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Stepchan |
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No. 6 makes me think of Malroth/Sidoh from Dragon Warrior/Quest 2... Although after playing 1, 3 and 4 beforehand, it wasn't that big of a
surprise.
I'm Catsuri, meow!
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Kitsunexus |
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Posts: 106 (05/23/08 11:52 AM) Banned User |
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CRAWLand1000 |
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Kojima has broken almost all of them. He might have been one of the prime inspirations for the list to begin with.
"Without a foothold in the past, we cannot walk towards the future." -Vagrant Story |
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Kitsunexus |
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Posts: 106 (05/23/08 1:49 PM) Banned User |
CRAWLand1000 wrote: Actually, re-reading the list, you are exactly right. He broke all 12 with MGS2 alone! 0____0
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TaroSH |
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CRAWLand1000 wrote: Or Suda51. |
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da dick |
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BTW Flying Omlette, you forgot to mention the BIGGEST victim of #11: Legacy of Kain 2: Soul Reaver. LoK had vampys which weren't emo fags, and the great big evil in the "big reveal" in the ending of the last game had tentacles. what's more evil than evil tentacles who control your destiny!?!? can't ever feel sorry for the game series. it's so evil and existential. on 2nd thought, i don't like games which always make the existential peeps evil.
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Crawl and 1OOO |
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What word do you like more, existential, or indie?
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lighthouseboy |
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Actually, I like the "sequel" ending sometimes. That's one of the things I thought was collest about Arc the Lad 1
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TaroSH |
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Another popular form of "big reveal" is when a being, usually obscured, promises the hero their fondest wish if they do a favor for it, only for it
to be revealed the being was evil and was using the hero to release its power, and now that's it's free its first victim is/will be the hero.
See: Wario Land 3, Shadow of the Colossus. Also, just about every cartoon ever made. |
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Crawl and 1OOO |
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The original Grimm's Fairy Tales had the exact opposite of that in some stories, where a character wanted something gruesome (to have their own head and
feet cut off or something), and the hero refused to do it, but when the hero finally relented, it turned out that was the condition to breaking an evil curse,
so it wasn't gruesome after all.
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Flying Omelette |
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I don't mind an ending setting up for a sequel just so long as the current story has resolution. The ending of Arc 4 took care of the final boss, but
everything else that had been addressed in the story before that (remembering that he only came into it at the last minute anyway) is left hanging. And then
the sequel is a clusterfuck that answers nothing.
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TaroSH |
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Perhaps a broader rewriting of my earlier post is, when somebody or something pretends to be on the hero's side, but then, surprise surprise! At or towards
the end of the game we find they're evil and were just using the hero for their own gain.
Bioshock combines this with the Scooby Doo unmasking. There's this guy named Atlas talking to Jack through a walkie-talkie like he's going to help Jack through Rapture, and from the start I knew that guy was going to backstab me. Then sure enough, he reveals he's really some pirate named Fontaine who was mentioned a few times in some audio logs, and was just using Jack to steal Rapture from Andrew Ryan, and tries to kill Jack afterwards. |
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greybob |
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That evil reveal thing is in Portal, too, where GlaDOS is guiding you through the game with a promise of "cake" at the end, but in reality she's
trying to kill your character.
I used to think the story of Final Fantasy 7 was "brilliant" but now I know it's just convoluted. :P In fact, Tetsuya Nomura seems to be a big storytelling sinner, in general. FFVII had alot of these cliches, FFVIII had the Last Boss Out of Nowhere, amnesia, and probably others that I can't think of right now. FFX sort of had Last Boss Out of Nowhere. Kingdom Hearts had a really screwed up and convoluted story, but I don't think it violates any one of these specifically. The World Ends With You started out with a good story, but after some interesting reveals it eventually started going downhill in the story department. Then there's a big WTF Irrelevant Twist at the end of the game, before you face the final boss, that completely breaks the entire story. I still enjoy Final Fantasy 7. I don't even know why; it's not the music, it's not the gameplay, and it's DEFINETLY not the graphics. Collecting and leveling materia is kind of fun in a weird sort of way, and there's some entertaining mini-games. But, it's like another online reviewer said, "Maybe if you made the core gameplay more substantial, you wouldn't need to break up the monotony with pointless minigames." Maybe it's because the story is so messed up, so bizarre, so convoluted, that it's actually so bad it's good. I mean, in what other game do you dress up your character as a woman to sneak into a mobster's hideout? Not even GTA has done anything like that. |
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greybob |
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Oh, and I forgot to mention A Link to the Past. To be fair, it's an early attempt to implement an actual plot into a game, let alone a Zelda game, but
it's definetly got problems. For example, there's a Big Reveal/Scooby-Doo Unmasking/Irrelevant Twist when Agharrhim (or however it is that you spell
the wizard's name) is revealed to be Ganon. When I figured this out, it was like "So what?" We already knew that the wizard was working directly
as Ganon's pawn, so there's not really any point in making them the same person; their motives and operations would be the same regardless.
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CLOUDBOND007 |
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It's pretty obvious after about 10 minutes that GlaDOS is unhinged. After 2001 and countless other stories with deranged computers, it doesn't really
come as much of a surprise that she eventually becomes homicidal.
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greybob |
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That remind me: have you ever noticed that ever since 2001 came out, all evil computers and robots act like HAL? There was HARDAC in Batman TAS, that little
auto-pilot robot in WALL-E, etc. etc. Even KARR from Knightrider shows "influence" from the grand-daddy of all corrupted AI.
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TaroSH |
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What Seabu said. There's also SHODAN in System Shock and I'm pretty sure Galerians (sp?) for the Playstation is about a corrupt AI as well. Rez is also
about a computer running everything, except it doesn't decide to wipe out humanity it just goes all emo.
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greybob |
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If your computer ever turns emo, just download lots of pictures of kitties and puppies and bunnies onto it!
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